What would you do to make WAR better?

[Bulbasaur]

WAR was stopped for a reason. It had a negative impact on the forum.
There are always other team based mini events that could work. In its place.

Come on, dude! Just because you personally did not approve of WAR doesn't mean it should not happen for everyone. WAR worked out for over ten years; there is no reason to scrap an idea that worked perfectly fine!

Regardless, this thread is not to argue about why WAR shouldn't happen but rather how we can improve it.

On topic, I think we have some good ideas. I agree 100% with the majority of them; such as a shorter time duration and drafting members.

[Neo Emolga]

WAR was stopped for a reason. It had a negative impact on the forum.
There are always other team based mini events that could work. In its place.

As Eric said, we have had WAR plenty of times before and it has worked out well in the past. True, sometimes tweaking to the system is necessary given that the community's desires and expectations change from time to time, but it's something that could be done to ensure most desires are met.

Generally, I think the WAR has had more of a positive effect than negative. A lot of art pieces, writing pieces, and activity that wouldn't have been made otherwise came out of it being done for the WAR. The issue before was the discrepancy in team sizes. We're trying to find alternative ways to make it work.

Now, the plan I outlined above is a combination of ideas that hasn't been employed before together in this format. One year, we had a WAR where there were three teams, draft-based, and people made the team theme after the first batch of people had been drafted. This actually worked out remarkably well (I think it was WAR VIII that did this, but I don't remember exactly). I think it's an idea worth trying once again. Usually, the complaint against drafting was people ended up on teams they didn't like. Here, they would simply be grouped up with other peeps and then they would decide what kind of team they'd like to create together. For that, I think it's a lot more unique and shows unity and teamwork among the members. Not to mention by this drafting, we'll have even teams.

The outline I also mentioned above uses Neko's idea to have participation have value by giving the judges WAY more points to work with (kind of in an inflated point economy way, but that's okay), so they'll be able to award things that come in fifth, sixth, and seventh place a little share of the point pot while still rewarding the quality entries with a larger share. Now this idea has yet to be done at all, so this may very well be the magic ingredient that makes it finally work in a way everyone likes.

I still say we give it a shot.

[Bulbasaur]

As Eric said, we have had WAR plenty of times before and it has worked out well in the past. True, sometimes tweaking to the system is necessary given that the community's desires and expectations change from time to time, but it's something that could be done to ensure most desires are met.

Generally, I think the WAR has had more of a positive effect than negative. A lot of art pieces, writing pieces, and activity that wouldn't have been made otherwise came out of it being done for the WAR. The issue before was the discrepancy in team sizes. We're trying to find alternative ways to make it work.

Now, the plan I outlined above is a combination of ideas that hasn't been employed before together in this format. One year, we had a WAR where there were three teams, draft-based, and people made the team theme after the first batch of people had been drafted. This actually worked out remarkably well (I think it was WAR VIII that did this, but I don't remember exactly). I think it's an idea worth trying once again. Usually, the complaint against drafting was people ended up on teams they didn't like. Here, they would simply be grouped up with other peeps and then they would decide what kind of team they'd like to create together. For that, I think it's a lot more unique and shows unity and teamwork among the members. Not to mention by this drafting, we'll have even teams.

The outline I also mentioned above uses Neko's idea to have participation have value by giving the judges WAY more points to work with (kind of in an inflated point economy way, but that's okay), so they'll be able to award things that come in fifth, sixth, and seventh place a little share of the point pot while still rewarding the quality entries with a larger share. Now this idea has yet to be done at all, so this may very well be the magic ingredient that makes it finally work in a way everyone likes.

I still say we give it a shot.

That's a good point, with the voting of themes. There was a lot of bias to certain teams in the past based on the theme, so between that and drafting, we could make the majority of people participating happy!

[Nekomata]

As Eric said, we have had WAR plenty of times before and it has worked out well in the past. True, sometimes tweaking to the system is necessary given that the community's desires and expectations change from time to time, but it's something that could be done to ensure most desires are met.

Generally, I think the WAR has had more of a positive effect than negative. A lot of art pieces, writing pieces, and activity that wouldn't have been made otherwise came out of it being done for the WAR. The issue before was the discrepancy in team sizes. We're trying to find alternative ways to make it work.

Now, the plan I outlined above is a combination of ideas that hasn't been employed before together in this format. One year, we had a WAR where there were three teams, draft-based, and people made the team theme after the first batch of people had been drafted. This actually worked out remarkably well (I think it was WAR VIII that did this, but I don't remember exactly). I think it's an idea worth trying once again. Usually, the complaint against drafting was people ended up on teams they didn't like. Here, they would simply be grouped up with other peeps and then they would decide what kind of team they'd like to create together. For that, I think it's a lot more unique and shows unity and teamwork among the members. Not to mention by this drafting, we'll have even teams.

The outline I also mentioned above uses Neko's idea to have participation have value by giving the judges WAY more points to work with (kind of in an inflated point economy way, but that's okay), so they'll be able to award things that come in fifth, sixth, and seventh place a little share of the point pot while still rewarding the quality entries with a larger share. Now this idea has yet to be done at all, so this may very well be the magic ingredient that makes it finally work in a way everyone likes.

I still say we give it a shot.

I'm willing to give it another shot! As I said, I wouldn't have put the effort into coming up with ideas to improve it if I didn't think it was worth it back then. I'm not sure how I feel about the draft- since I can definitely see where there are concerns with ending up with people you don't like, but I think it could bring some good too, like making people get to know one another better!

And yeah, my idea for the more inflated point economy (as you describe it) was to encourage participation from everyone. I saw one major problem with the past war is people felt they weren't able to contribute because they couldn't win! It's discouraging when your efforts go to absolutely no worth! People spent a lot of time on entries and got nothing for it- and I can see how that would make some people drop out after a round or three.

I liked the idea of WAR because it was a team-based thing where everyone would come together for some friendly fun! I was a little upset at how quickly people gave up on it after the last time.

[AD]

@Neo Emolga
You had me at drafting. *puts on my jersey*

[Rival Max]

Come on, dude! Just because you personally did not approve of WAR doesn't mean it should not happen for everyone. WAR worked out for over ten years; there is no reason to scrap an idea that worked perfectly fine!

Regardless, this thread is not to argue about why WAR shouldn't happen but rather how we can improve it.

On topic, I think we have some good ideas. I agree 100% with the majority of them; such as a shorter time duration and drafting members.

Why do think Sarah walked away from this thread? WARs were stopped. Im slightly confused why you would think that I have something personal against WAR. Are facts not recognized here because of good or bad feelings?

Its also a little biased to mention only the fun you had and leave out the long term effects that WAR had on the community. My opinion on war will always be the after effect of the forum being almost empty for over a month in the summmer.
It also should be noted this isnt pe2k. The forum community is smaller and generally more relaxed. Thats why the current style of events does so well.

[Bulbasaur]

Why do think Sarah walked away from this thread? WARs were stopped. Im slightly confused why you would think that I have something personal against WAR. Are facts not recognized here because of good or bad feelings?

Its also a little biased to mention only the fun you had and leave out the long term effects that WAR had on the community. My opinion on war will always be the after effect of the forum being almost empty for over a month in the summmer.
It also should be noted this isnt pe2k. The forum community is smaller and generally more relaxed. Thats why the current style of events does so well.

I am not arguing about this here. If you want to continue this message me. Otherwise please stay on topic. We have a right to come up with improvements.

[Nekomata]

Why do think Sarah walked away from this thread? WARs were stopped. Im slightly confused why you would think that I have something personal against WAR. Are facts not recognized here because of good or bad feelings?

Its also a little biased to mention only the fun you had and leave out the long term effects that WAR had on the community. My opinion on war will always be the after effect of the forum being almost empty for over a month in the summmer.
It also should be noted this isnt pe2k. The forum community is smaller and generally more relaxed. Thats why the current style of events does so well.

I know that some people, like Sarah, may not want to discuss things due to how the last war ended on such a negative note. That said, we're not discussing whether it'll happen or not, just what we'd do to improve it. Do remember that discussion on this was quickly shut down after the last war, so no one really got to talk about- and that upset some people. It's -nice- to let our thoughts out even if nothing will come of it. Good or bad feelings, we're not ignoring the facts or what happened. We're just having a -friendly- discussion.

In fact, I think it's GOOD for us to discuss what we would do to make it better- regardless if we plan on ever doing it. Why? We need to understand what made it so negative for some and what people would like to have seen done instead. If we can understand what went wrong, we can better form future events by avoiding the same mistakes. Feedback on events is incredibly important- even for one time events. What did people like? What did people dislike? How can we use this feedback to build on other things?

For example, people said they felt excluded in the sense that the events were in sections they were not a part of. So do we find ways to make the sections more inclusive to new people, or maybe extend it across more section? People were concerned about group sizes. How can we adjust future events to make groups more balanced? These are the kind of things a discussion on WAR can help us with. WAR or no, I think it's a talk worth having.

[Rival Max]

I am not arguing about this here. If you want to continue this message me. Otherwise please stay on topic. We have a right to come up with improvements.

We're not arguing at all...You tagged me and Im responding. If you feel like this is an argument there is a mis understanding here.

I know that some people, like Sarah, may not want to discuss things due to how the last war ended on such a negative note. That said, we're not discussing whether it'll happen or not, just what we'd do to improve it. Do remember that discussion on this was quickly shut down after the last war, so no one really got to talk about- and that upset some people. It's -nice- to let our thoughts out even if nothing will come of it. Good or bad feelings, we're not ignoring the facts or what happened. We're just having a -friendly- discussion.

In fact, I think it's GOOD for us to discuss what we would do to make it better- regardless if we plan on ever doing it. Why? We need to understand what made it so negative for some and what people would like to have seen done instead. If we can understand what went wrong, we can better form future events by avoiding the same mistakes. Feedback on events is incredibly important- even for one time events. What did people like? What did people dislike? How can we use this feedback to build on other things?

For example, people said they felt excluded in the sense that the events were in sections they were not a part of. So do we find ways to make the sections more inclusive to new people, or maybe extend it across more section? People were concerned about group sizes. How can we adjust future events to make groups more balanced? These are the kind of things a discussion on WAR can help us with. WAR or no, I think it's a talk worth having.

It was shut down fast because of how poor that last war ended. If Sarah the most chill person on this forum is avoiding a topic there is a reason. My opinion is just that it should be noted that WARs are a double edged sword.

If there are a lot of people passionate about it then of course it should be discussed:)

[Pokemon Trainer Sarah]

Don't get me wrong, I'm fine with another WAR happening, it just brings back bad memories after seeing that thread. o_o I really thought I was over it by now but yeah. xD

Most of the fun of WAR for me was making a team and recruiting and making everyone banners and fostering a friendly team spirit! So I've never liked the idea of drafts and stuff like that, it makes it all too serious. But I think I'll just stay right out of the planning. If you guys wanna try it again, I'll support you. But I also think we've done a lot of great other events and we were doing good focusing on those rather than one huge one!

Therefore my suggestions to you guys are to try and make it a smaller thing like our other events, leave out the large scale RPGs which were a bit exclusive anyway, have more fun one-off events and just have 3 weeks since activity always drops rapidly after that anyway. If it's not such a huge thing maybe everyone won't be majorly burnt out and go inactive afterwards, like Max was saying. xD

I'd like to do a Pokemon GO Johto version at some point this year (but actually planned out this time since I know what I'm doing! xD) and I know we have Stalkers coming, and Easter and plenty of other fun stuff. Maybe try and make WAR just one of many events instead of the be all and end all, then people might not take it as seriously also!